Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by pete on September 18, 2009 at 1:40

Don't think they're runners Roger, more likely French beans, and with these I've always stuck with the variety Blue Lake (for the pods) -- in fact I had to accompany the women folk to the theatre tonight - half hour to grab a bite - dish of them with butter, soo good!

But have a look here and here.

Have you seen my recipe for egg and baked bean curry in The Gardener's Inn? - It may look scary but it does taste very good. Trust your veg plots are coming on...

Permalink Reply by Bigyin on September 18, 2009 at 18:35

Thanks for your comments and links guys. I've searched through a lot of seed supplier sites and still haven't found any. Re the veg plots Pete:- Yes, it's all change at the moment. We're running down the one at the side of the house and I've started on the new one out beside the olive grove. I'm initially doing 8, 6m x 1.2m beds with a little roundabout in the middle for herbs. I've rock cleared, rotovated and soil improved the first two and planted 36 broad beans in one of them. I'll put alfalfa in the second and when the next two are prepared, I'll put a later variety of bean in one of those. Marge loves broad beans and they'll put some nitrogen in the soil. We're gonna keep the back plot going for a while for odds and ends. The side one is gonna be turned into part of a flower garden. I'll add some stuff to my blog when I've made some more progress.
Onward and Upward,
Rog

Permalink Reply by pete on September 21, 2009 at 4:17

Well Roger, did you find some... I've been busy (Mrs has gone to Wales) - and its got to be...

Dark Red Kidney Bean
Origin: USA

The Dark Red Kidney Bean is the famous dry bean that is used in Chili Con Carne and various other well known dishes. This variety is also known as the Red Bean, which sometimes causes confusion between it and the Adzuki Bean. The Red Kidney is a medium sized variety of the common bean (Phaseolus vulgaris) and features a dark red shell with a cream colored flesh. Its popularity can be attributed to its excellent flavor and many uses. Dark Red Kidney Beans are a bush variety which are produced on a sturdy plant which yields an abundance of hearty pods that contain five large red, kidney shaped beans. Matures in 95 days.

Some other varieties being tested for the canning industry: Red Hawk; Montcalm; Drake; Isles ...

But where to get them from?

I did find some red seed dwarf french bean for sale here - The Organic Gardening Catalogue -

but then .... in zambia small farmers were once (in 1937) officially recommended to grow Canadian Wonder but they prefered to grow large Cranberry beans (speckled sugar beans)such as Natal Sugar

This from some site's forum page:

Q. Does anyone know where I can get dark red kidney bean seeds? I orderd some off a web sight, but they sent me light red, and now they wont return my emails regarding getting the error fixed....

A. Have you checked the grocery store? Around here they sell both dark and light in the bagged dried bean section. Just buy a bag and plant them. Works fine.

How 'bout that, some grocer by you might sell them Roger.

Had you considered raised/deep beds for the veg plots by the way?

Permalink Reply by Bigyin on September 21, 2009 at 10:15

Hi Pete,
I'd better reply to this in bits as it's now become two subjects and the reply could become an essay. Sorry for the delay. I find it very frustrating when I take the trouble to reply to an enquiry and the original poster then either doesn't reply for ages or worse still, not at all.
I've done a little bit more searching and I think that you're right about them being more of a french bean than a runner. I missed the left hand of your two "here" links in your original reply and Colin posted the same link later.
Regarding supply of seeds, I decided that one of the names on the allotments UK site:- http://www.allotment.org.uk/garden/Seed_Suppliers/index.php looked more promising than the rest (although they didn't list them) so I emailed them. This is what they came back with:-
"Dear Roger,

You can buy dry bulk seed of Red Kidney beans in health food shops. These are very likely to germinate and grow well for you. They are Dwarf French beans so find growing instructions in any good gardening book. In UK Sow mid May in small pots for planting out first week in June.

Hope this helps.

Regards,

Beans and Herbs"
Very helpful I thought and nice to come accross a company that is genuinely helpful rather than just out to make a sale. They even encourage you to harvest the seed from the plants grown from their seed. Marge is going back to UK for a month in October so I''ll get her to pick some up. This text pane has gone strange so I'll continue in another post.

Permalink Reply by Bigyin on September 21, 2009 at 10:46

Hi Colin,
I take your point about the benefit of digging in before flowering. However, bear in mind that things are very different here than in UK. The "soil" that I'm starting with is hardpan sand and rocks. Strangly enough, fertility doesn't seem to be so much of a problem as structure so my main aim is to improve structure and take the fertility issue as I go along. The roots of the broady's will help with this, Marge will eat the beans until they come out of her ears and digging in the spent top growth won't do any harm. By the way, I found this http://www.the-organic-gardener.com/green-manure.html which I thought was a good laymen's (among which I count myself) explanation.
Water butts are a rarity here and there's not enough rain to fill them with. I have to irrigate everything. "chickweed" ? I wouldn't know it if I saw it among the million or so varieties that abound here :-)
Alfalfa in the other beds will also help break up the soil deeper down I think.

colin said:

using green manures to renitrify the soil is only effective when the plants are turned in before flowering. after flowering they start to draw the nitrogen from the soil! maybe worth getting water buts and some nets of manure soaking in them as your nitrification or instead of removing chickweed dig it in as that is aslo a nitrifying plant

Bigyin said:

Thanks for your comments and links guys. I've searched through a lot of seed supplier sites and still haven't found any. Re the veg plots Pete:- Yes, it's all change at the moment. We're running down the one at the side of the house and I've started on the new one out beside the olive grove. I'm initially doing 8, 6m x 1.2m beds with a little roundabout in the middle for herbs. I've rock cleared, rotovated and soil improved the first two and planted 36 broad beans in one of them. I'll put alfalfa in the second and when the next two are prepared, I'll put a later variety of bean in one of those. Marge loves broad beans and they'll put some nitrogen in the soil. We're gonna keep the back plot going for a while for odds and ends. The side one is gonna be turned into part of a flower garden. I'll add some stuff to my blog when I've made some more progress.
Onward and Upward,
Rog

Permalink Reply by Bigyin on September 21, 2009 at 12:03

Right....that's beans and green manure sorted :-). Raised beds. I've discussed this in the past with Kerry John. In my opinion, they would be the ideal solution to the soil problems I face. With the new beds that I'm in the process of creating, I'm just tilling and improving at ground level in order to get things moving. That leaves me the option of containing the growing areas in raised beds at a later date. Although it may sound as if I'm constantly coming up with excuses, it wouldn't be a small job. The eight new beds would need about 120 linear meters of retaining wall. The favorite would be timber but that's very expensive here (not used much in construction). Even reclaimed stuff is dear. The most common material is concrete block but that would not be cheap and would be a lot of hard work. The cheapest would be to re-use he rock I'm digging out but that would be a lot of fiddly work and would harbour pests (portugese millipedes and wasps to which I'm extremely allergic). If I do it at all, I'll probably use one of the many designs of hollow brick available here. Probably no more expensive than blocks, easier to handle and with a better finished appearance. I think I've covered most of the topics. Please give me a shout if not.
Cheers all,
Roger

Permalink Reply by Bigyin on September 21, 2009 at 12:08

Right....Off out now to pick up a few more rocks.

Permalink Reply by Bigyin on September 22, 2009 at 20:02

I think that's a bit of an understatement Colin :-)
As I said, there will be eight beds. I've prepared the first two. I removed all the large rocks, rotovated, and raked out the smaller rocks. I then spread the content of one compost bin (about a cubic metre) over them and raked that in followed by four trugs of seived horse manure. I've planted about 30 broad beans in two rows in the first bed and I'm going to put alfalfa in the second one. As regards the rest, I'm now about 8/10 of the way to removing larger surface rocks and then the other six beds will get the same treatment. The improvement process will go on continuously over time. The total area of the plot, including paths is 170 sq metres. Before any more serious planting happens I'll need to fence the whole area (about 54 linear metres) to keep the flippin' rabbits out.

Permalink Reply by Bigyin on September 22, 2009 at 21:01

The law is quite strict here. We get a lot of casadores (hunters) around here. They are registered and use shotguns. The season starts 1st Oct so you'd best get packing.

Permalink Reply by Bigyin on September 22, 2009 at 22:11

Is it a .177 or .22 ? If I get one here it will probably be a Gamo.

Permalink Reply by Bigyin on September 23, 2009 at 12:39

Sounds lethal and obviously works if the local population has delined. Unfortunately, rabbit's breeding habits being what they are, the hunters never really make an impression on the overall numbers. I bought three proper traps and laid bait trails (carrot/lettuce) up to them. The little beggers ate the trails but wouldn't venture into the traps themselves. More trials needed on that I think.

Permalink Reply by Bigyin on September 25, 2009 at 9:00

Thanks for the helpful advice colin. :-) Apparently, the Spanish for ferret is hurón so I'll ask at the pet shop (if I can find one).