Open Association of Landscape Industries
Is Landscape Juice ready to start an association?
I have sensed a little restlessness of late..don't read me wrong, I view this as a good thing because it proves to me that members feel connected: it means we are maturing into a cohesive organisation and it probably means we are ready for change.
I maintain that LJN should always remain free to the user and I think that should continue. It is, essentially a privately owned forum and for that reason, maintaining political motion will always have a certain resistance - I don't intend to give up LJN or LJ and I don't intend to give it away....I will to continue finance it both sites through donations, advertising and private projects.
I am now proposing that we form a separate land-based association that is run by its members, for its members.
I would propose (not exhaustive):
Start a new website to act as the hub of the organisation (paper not to be used unless it is absolutely necessary) - this will be password protected and publicised via members' websites, blogs and Landscape Juice.
I personally will not agree to:
Membership and costs
This is a difficult one - we should not omit anyone because they cannot afford fees so I propose a joining fee to cover administration and a yearly fee set as a percentage of turnover.
I don't want to blow my own trumpet but I feel this will only work if the committee apply a great passion, move fast and remain extremely active.
I will be happy to work in a paid capacity to run any new association or acts as its communications officer. Landscape Juice is now an extremely strong media outlet and I am confident it will be an excellent platform with which to publish news of this fledgling organisation.
I will not act alone or autonomously and it is in our interests for all elected officers to remain transparent in their duties at all times.
We should all be reminded that we owe it to ourselves to conduct our business honestly and fairly and any bad publicity in this new organisation could have a long lasting negative effect.
Whilst anyone should be able to join....membership should not be taken lightly and only serious businesses and individuals should consider it as a route of industry and business development.
There's loads more I can add but it's time to put it out for discussion and, if this were to go ahead, I would expect everyone to pull their weight and work within strict timetables and keep to their promises.
Please add your thoughts, suggestions or disapprovals.
I maintain that LJN should always remain free to the user and I think that should continue. It is, essentially a privately owned forum and for that reason, maintaining political motion will always have a certain resistance - I don't intend to give up LJN or LJ and I don't intend to give it away....I will to continue finance it both sites through donations, advertising and private projects.
I am now proposing that we form a separate land-based association that is run by its members, for its members.
I would propose (not exhaustive):
Start a new website to act as the hub of the organisation (paper not to be used unless it is absolutely necessary) - this will be password protected and publicised via members' websites, blogs and Landscape Juice.
- Shall register as a legal association and comply with whatever rules apply
- Write a constitution
- Conduct our business in a transparent and honest manner
- Elect a 6-8 person committee who shall do the leg-work and represent members' interests
- Appoint a treasurer, set up a company bank account and publish our accounts to our members through the site.
- Hold at least one live committee meeting every week
- Hold at least one members forum meeting a month
- Set up training schemes for members
- Set up a legal helpline
- Create specific documents for all members to download
- Lobby government and other organisations to help shape land-based industries
- Encourage higher standards via educational advances
- Represent everyone in our industry and discourage individualism.
- Encourage knowledge sharing right down to the the newest entrants into the land-based sector
- Create our own conference and annual show/exhibition
I personally will not agree to:
- Discriminate against bona fide businesses and individuals
- Impose unnecessary boundaries to membership or personal and professional development
- Use the association as a personal vehicle to success
Membership and costs
This is a difficult one - we should not omit anyone because they cannot afford fees so I propose a joining fee to cover administration and a yearly fee set as a percentage of turnover.
I don't want to blow my own trumpet but I feel this will only work if the committee apply a great passion, move fast and remain extremely active.
I will be happy to work in a paid capacity to run any new association or acts as its communications officer. Landscape Juice is now an extremely strong media outlet and I am confident it will be an excellent platform with which to publish news of this fledgling organisation.
I will not act alone or autonomously and it is in our interests for all elected officers to remain transparent in their duties at all times.
We should all be reminded that we owe it to ourselves to conduct our business honestly and fairly and any bad publicity in this new organisation could have a long lasting negative effect.
Whilst anyone should be able to join....membership should not be taken lightly and only serious businesses and individuals should consider it as a route of industry and business development.
There's loads more I can add but it's time to put it out for discussion and, if this were to go ahead, I would expect everyone to pull their weight and work within strict timetables and keep to their promises.
Please add your thoughts, suggestions or disapprovals.
Tags: apl, architect, associations, bali, design, gardening, land-based, landscaping, sgd
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by john page on -
I would back this form of association based on the way ljn has developed & hopefully the new association would develop in the same way.Having never been on a committee before I would not feel confident enoughto put myself forward to be a committee member but would be willing to give as much support & help as I could to any committee & the development of it
regards
john
cole green landscapers
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Permalink Reply by Laurel on -
I strongly believe that an association would divide the current LJN community, even if it were to be made completely separate.
I also believe trade associations have had their day. If the industry really needs ‘change’ then there needs to be a whole new model. All we really need as an industry is support and guidance, not rules, regulations and a sticker to put on our vans... Surely all these ideas proposed can be executed without the need for another trade association and all the and elitist rubbish that comes with them.
I feel that this idea for an association has been born because there is a lack of funding required for Philip to implement new ideas, but also because Philip needs the support of paying members to be heard by the big boys.
Personally I like the idea of a member’s area. Access to this area could be paid monthly / quarterly or whatever. This area could contain all of the benefits of being in an association, but without all the rubbish.
If we want to be ‘different’ from the rest, then surely we need to do something that is actually different.
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Permalink Reply by Richard@www.seasons-garden.co.uk on -
My 2 penneth's worth is this:
The site is great as it is - if it aint broke..........
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I wouldn't have a problem paying membership in order to tighten up online security and fund improvements etc
.
The people who use the site are right across the spectrum in terms of skills & quals and I think its down to the individual to look after his/her business in terms of regs, legal stuff etc
.
If you did have an association it would only take 1 rotten apple to affect another's reputation. Personally I don't see the need to join a body, the quality of my work & service does the talking and I'll stand by that any day.
.
Top work on a marvellous site, Phil!
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Permalink Reply by Nicky @ GardenImprovements.com on -
It is clear that some members are posting without reading the full thread. This causes repeat questions and answers and inhibits the progress of the debate.
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Permalink Reply by John on
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A membership scheme for LJN has been discussed thoroughly many times over and discarded for many reasons.
I would still like to know how many people would be prepared to donate £50 a year, either monthly, quartely or yearly.
With the first three months free for new members
Just a simple, Yes or No
Richard said:My 2 penneth's worth is this:
The site is great as it is - if it aint broke..........
.
I wouldn't have a problem paying membership in order to tighten up online security and fund improvements etc
.
The people who use the site are right across the spectrum in terms of skills & quals and I think its down to the individual to look after his/her business in terms of regs, legal stuff etc
.
If you did have an association it would only take 1 rotten apple to affect another's reputation. Personally I don't see the need to join a body, the quality of my work & service does the talking and I'll stand by that any day.
.
Top work on a marvellous site, Phil!
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Permalink Reply by Laurel on
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I agree with Paul. I would be more than happy to make a monthly donation/ subscription by standing order or simillar.
I don't know if my last post was clear or to the point enough to satisfy all members.
Q: Is LJN ready to start an association?
A: No, it's obvious that opinions are too divided at this time.
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PRO MemberPermalink Reply by Graeme @ BGS on -
This is my last post on the subject (well may be not!)
I have re-read all 146 odd replies and unless mistaken about 15 clear YES in favour and 5 or 6 against, and probably 15 undecided. All the other posts have been unrelated to the key question.
Unless mistaken I have only seen about 5 postings which have attempted to state with some small reason as to WHY a new association should be created.
With greatest respect to Phil in his original post he stated some of the aims and objectives which could be adopted by the new proposed association but hasn't in my mind stated the case as to WHY we need a new association. I don't want to be disrespectful to anyone but I question how many members can actually say why we need a new association and what purpose it will serve. Yes one or two are anti the current associations but because you can't or don't want to join them isn't a reason to form a new one!
Times are changing and the likes of Richard and Jason at the helm of the two key associations will make great in-roads and adapt and change, they will become a far greater force to be reckoned with and yet may not address the many issues that the non members of this great industry face and care strongly about.
Having a paid membership scheme is different from a formal association, to make a real difference will take some time and money. Last time we discussed paid membership the majority didn't see any need to pay for information or for the possible benefits that they could gain from it. I therefore have to question if these very people would now pay for an association which in a large part would be more towards promoting the industry we all work in (or sit on a desk).
My gut feeling and I may well be and hope I am wrong, this feels to me like New Labour of the 90's - a great idea but we don't really know what it is all about but must be good as it supports the little hard working guy on the street but look at the mess we are in! :-)
Please don't get me wrong, I have already stated that if for the right reasons a new "all embracing" association could take the lead for the better of all of us working within this industry. We just need to make sure we all understand the WHY and then the cost and level of involvement required. It will need a strong commitment from each and everyone of us. How many are ready for change and also put their hand in their pocket to support it.
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Permalink Reply by John on
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I forgot to state that I do and will continue to donate to the site. So, - yes.
Paul Williams said:I probably would, but no more than that. I pay £40 odd to the iog & I don't get as much out of it as I do LJN. I have received so much helpful advice from this site I wouldn't want to be without it. Just don't start bringing in stupid joining requirements. Either pay & join or don't, simples.
Ace Garden Services - John said:A membership scheme for LJN has been discussed thoroughly many times over and discarded for many reasons.
I would still like to know how many people would be prepared to donate £50 a year, either monthly, quartely or yearly.
With the first three months free for new members
Just a simple, Yes or No
Richard said:My 2 penneth's worth is this:
The site is great as it is - if it aint broke..........
.
I wouldn't have a problem paying membership in order to tighten up online security and fund improvements etc
.
The people who use the site are right across the spectrum in terms of skills & quals and I think its down to the individual to look after his/her business in terms of regs, legal stuff etc
.
If you did have an association it would only take 1 rotten apple to affect another's reputation. Personally I don't see the need to join a body, the quality of my work & service does the talking and I'll stand by that any day.
.
Top work on a marvellous site, Phil!
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Permalink Reply by john glover on -
please say your views claudia,
this is what its for and you are a valuable member of the group .
rob
(gardens 4u.co.uk)
claudia de yong said:Seems to be a male battlefield on this subject! I am terrified to comment!
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PRO MemberPermalink Reply by Stephen @ SJS on -
Have no issues with regards to paying a membership fee, if it is beneficial to all then it is the way forward.
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Permalink Reply by claudia de yong on -
Size doesn't matter!! The point of any association I feel is to act as a united body that can effect change and benefit all members. It will never be right for everyone, after all we are all individuals and have our own opinions and goals but if helps the majority then it must be a good thing. It also depends on how much you are prepared to commit. It is like going to a a school which has all the wonderful facilities- no use if you don't use them!
Andrew Bentley said:Hello everyone - happy valentines' day! (Especially to the ladies!)
Some really interesting debates here, and one or two comments that disappoint me concerning how businesses are run.... Does size really matter??! I am a passionate gardener and I strive to give my clients a very good service - reliable, friendly, flexible, cost-effective etc. BUT, I work out of the back of my estate car and I am not VAT registered. Having said that, I do have a degree and various short course certificates, I have £1million Public Liability insurance, and I use good quality, well maintained equipment and tools to get the job done. But it seems there are people on this forum who think because I don't have the necessary turnover to be VAT registered or drive a van that I might be excluded! To be honest, I think I could give a fair number of those people a run for their money in terms of my knowledge and skills and abilities, I just like running a small business that doesn't take my whole life over!
Enough of my rant - this is the day for love...! But to get on track - a true debate on the way forward cannot really be constructive until we have some genuine structure to what this 'association' is going to look like - what costs, what benefits etc etc.... As we all know, there are lots of so called 'trade associations' around, and lots of other societies and so on that are happy to take our money on an annual basis. Can we have some real meat on the bones about what this one will actually be like?
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Permalink Reply by Nicky @ GardenImprovements.com on
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Graeme: I, among others, have clearly stated some the benefits of creating an official body. Your question is regarding the NEED for an association; I believe that if we are to secure these type benefits then our only recourse is to form an official association.
To those who have made the previous comparison to an "old boys club" institution, and who are mentioning car/van stickers, and who are saying things like "we don't need the extra business at the moment": YOU SIMPLY HAVE NOT READ THE THREAD PROPERLY
If the new association does not initiate through a genuine lack of support then so be it - as a member I have to accept that, but please don't let the project fail through ignorance, lack of consideration and flippancy.
It is imperative that the development of LJN into an official body would re-invent the concept of an associaton through our ideals of collaboration, mutual support and benefit, improving our industry and re-inventing the public view of our industry. The LJN forum should still run as is...nobody is going to lose that.
I cannot see ANY valid argument AGAINST an association.
Funding the LJN through donations will not work and donations are not a plausible method of sustainment. We are not a charity, we are both a business-to-business and a business-to-public network and it is clear we need proper sustainable funding. Sponsorship is possible but if we can create the New-Model association some of us are describing then I believe this to be the way forward.
Colin's funding idea of the member map with links and phone numbers is an excellent idea but I fear may not be enough.
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