Open Association of Landscape Industries
Hand Drawn Design or CAD
I have been trying to perfect the use of my 3D Designer program with varied success. The thought has occurred to me that customers might prefer the traditional hand drawn design which has a more one off personal feel. I would be interested to hear the thoughts of designers and customers alike. As I have never trained in IT hand drawing comes more naturally to me.
- Attachments:
Replies to This Discussion
-
Permalink Reply by Colin Elliott on -
Jonathan Wild said:
Hi Everyone,
The problem for me is that I realise I HAVE to get my act together and invest in the software, hardware and possibly training I need because I am increasingly having to transfer information and make amendments to plans. Case in point is my current project which is a very large (5 acre) design which has to be built at the same time the (rather large!) house is being rebuilt. I am working closely with the architect and as he only works in CAD it is getting very difficult - particularly as the project isn't just down the road! Luckily the client loves my concept and ideas - but now I'm having to get the architect's office to transfer this to the master plan!
If only I could use CAD!!!!
Any suggestions gratefully received!
If you have a 5 acre garden to build, I assume we are talking big construction and planting budgets and a very substantial design bill (?).
If you need CAD for this project you might like to communicate your design to a CAD proficient designer so he can draw it up for you in AutoCAd or whatever your architect is using.
I have seen the work of a number of "big names" in garden design done this way and we have undertaken drawings for builders, landscapers, developers, publishers and other garden designers over the years.
With the immediate worry of this project out of the way, you can train on a CAD system yourself without the pressure of learning on a 'live' job.
If you'd like our help on this, just ask.
Colin
-
Permalink Reply by Jonathan Wild on -
Thanks Colin,
Yes it is a big project and will eventually result in supplying plants and other materials such as water features etc - so I'm hopefully going to get enough 'return' to pay for all software and hardware I'm going to need to ramp up the business! Once upon a time I did employ a CAD proficient designer - which was a bit of a luxury and one I may resort to in the future if the work keeps coming in.
In the short term however I'm working closely with the architect and using him to draw up the masterplan. The client is happy with the arrangement - but can't say I am completeley as I feel I'm losing control!
Anyway thanks for the advice - as and when I get the opportunity to look at getting myself CAD 'equipped' I'll be in touch.......Cheers.
Colin Elliott said:Jonathan Wild said:Hi Everyone,
The problem for me is that I realise I HAVE to get my act together and invest in the software, hardware and possibly training I need because I am increasingly having to transfer information and make amendments to plans. Case in point is my current project which is a very large (5 acre) design which has to be built at the same time the (rather large!) house is being rebuilt. I am working closely with the architect and as he only works in CAD it is getting very difficult - particularly as the project isn't just down the road! Luckily the client loves my concept and ideas - but now I'm having to get the architect's office to transfer this to the master plan!
If only I could use CAD!!!!
Any suggestions gratefully received!
If you have a 5 acre garden to build, I assume we are talking big construction and planting budgets and a very substantial design bill (?).
If you need CAD for this project you might like to communicate your design to a CAD proficient designer so he can draw it up for you in AutoCAd or whatever your architect is using.
I have seen the work of a number of "big names" in garden design done this way and we have undertaken drawings for builders, landscapers, developers, publishers and other garden designers over the years.
With the immediate worry of this project out of the way, you can train on a CAD system yourself without the pressure of learning on a 'live' job.
If you'd like our help on this, just ask.
Colin
wwww.garden-design.co.uk
-
Permalink Reply by Paul-Mark vincent on -
Dear Nigel
Please see my reply to Charlotte Noar's thread which outlines my thoughts on this subject.
PM
-
Permalink Reply by Paul-Mark vincent on
-
Dear johnathan
I would be happy to be of assistance in you current CAD dillema. Please see my photos on this site or my website to see examples of my work.
Best PM
Jonathan Wild said:Thanks Colin,
Yes it is a big project and will eventually result in supplying plants and other materials such as water features etc - so I'm hopefully going to get enough 'return' to pay for all software and hardware I'm going to need to ramp up the business! Once upon a time I did employ a CAD proficient designer - which was a bit of a luxury and one I may resort to in the future if the work keeps coming in.
In the short term however I'm working closely with the architect and using him to draw up the masterplan. The client is happy with the arrangement - but can't say I am completeley as I feel I'm losing control!
Anyway thanks for the advice - as and when I get the opportunity to look at getting myself CAD 'equipped' I'll be in touch.......Cheers.
Colin Elliott said:Jonathan Wild said:
Hi Everyone,
The problem for me is that I realise I HAVE to get my act together and invest in the software, hardware and possibly training I need because I am increasingly having to transfer information and make amendments to plans. Case in point is my current project which is a very large (5 acre) design which has to be built at the same time the (rather large!) house is being rebuilt. I am working closely with the architect and as he only works in CAD it is getting very difficult - particularly as the project isn't just down the road! Luckily the client loves my concept and ideas - but now I'm having to get the architect's office to transfer this to the master plan!
If only I could use CAD!!!!
Any suggestions gratefully received!
If you have a 5 acre garden to build, I assume we are talking big construction and planting budgets and a very substantial design bill (?).
If you need CAD for this project you might like to communicate your design to a CAD proficient designer so he can draw it up for you in AutoCAd or whatever your architect is using.
I have seen the work of a number of "big names" in garden design done this way and we have undertaken drawings for builders, landscapers, developers, publishers and other garden designers over the years.
With the immediate worry of this project out of the way, you can train on a CAD system yourself without the pressure of learning on a 'live' job.
If you'd like our help on this, just ask.
Colin
-
Permalink Reply by a design and build company on -
Hi Folks,
This is my first post on LJN and it is on a subject which is close to my heart!
With nearly 20 years experience in the fields of landscape design & construction, my first job was working in an architects office in Hull way back in 1988. CAD was in it's infancy then and very few practices had adopted it. I was trained the 'traditional' way using Rotring Pens, Tracing Paper, Stencils and Scalpel blades etc.
The production time for drawings was enormous as so much time was spent cleaning out clogged pens, repairing holes in tracing paper, waiting for ink to dry and producing writing neat enough to read!
Even then the emphasis was not on producing a 'hand-drawn' effect but was to produce as 'clean' a drawing as possible which could be interpretated on site by a competant landscape contractor using simple graphical symbols that everyone new and understood.
I took this approach to college with me when I went to study for my HND in Horticulture as Askham Bryan College and was disapointed to discover that students projects were not judged on the quality of their designs but on how ornate a 'tree' they could draw in plan view!
Been given the choice between 'hand drawn' or 'CAD', it is a 'no-brainer' with me. Cad wins everytime. Although I can appreciate the beauty in old hand drawn plans produced by skilled old architects etc and the fluidity that hand drafting sometimes gives. I believe the advantages of using Cad far outweigh it's dis-advantages.
I like my drawings to be as accurate as possible from the moment I start drawing up my detailed surveys. Cad drawings are accurate to a fraction of a millemeter, hand drawn ones are not.
My workflow involves using Autocad compatible programs such as:
http://www.doublecad.com/Products/DoubleCADXT/tabid/1100/Default.aspx
I use these to produce my hard-landscape and planting plans and the export my base plans into:
http://sketchup.google.com/
Sketchup is fantastic and allows me to turn my design into 3D to for improved visualisation by the Client:
I then export information out of Sketchup into:
http://www.kerkythea.net/joomla/
Although I have not spent much time learning Kerkythea, it allows me to quickly produce photo-realistic images of my designs.
I then import my rendered images into Photoshop/Gimp:
http://www.gimp.org/
These programs allow me to manipulate the images adding effects such as lens blur (tilt shift photography) and lens flares to soften the images.
Examples of the above workflow can be found in the sample portfolio below:
http://www.facebook.com/album.php?aid=22948&id=1532320819&l...
Another major advantage of doing everything on the computer is that all printing can be done 'in-house' on an A3 ink jet printer thus saving enormous sums of money on expensive outside reprographic companies. A3 drawings are perfect for site use, laminating and spiral binding into ad-hoc portfolios.
In my experience, after an initial sharp learning curve, the use of Cad speeds up the process of producing designs to no end and gives the Client better value for money as they are paying the designer to produce a valid, site ready design drawing, not a meaningless 'pretty picture'.
I would not dream of reverting back to the 'old ways' of producing drawings and sometimes can't believe I used to receive an ok salary working in such a way.
Clive Warwick said:With your CAD problem that is! Not on site!
Clive Warwick said:I am willing to help on site too. Not to step on Colins feet! He was first.
I run a full CAD software with a landscape package.
Clive
#
-
Permalink Reply by Neil French on -
Hi,
I like many replying to this thread have not corresponded before. But this subject is very close to my heart. Coming from a engineering design background (over 20 years) and moving into gardening later in life I can appreciate both worlds, that being the board and the computer.
Drawings done by hand and to a professional level, can look fantastic, very warm and natural almost. Drawings by computer can feel a little sterile but has the accuracy that a hand drawing could never have (consistently). I use the CAD for designing hard landscape features. The CAD give me the accuracy that I require and the repeatability of input. Saving them to a library archive as 'blocks' and them inserting them as required.
Once drawn I can then very easily create a working drawing to have the features made. Once made, I know they will fit into place in the new garden without any worry.
I think its 'horses for courses'. Both have benefits, both have disadvantages. Take your pick.......
-
Permalink Reply by laara copley-smith on -
I very much agree with Kerrie & others on the freehand drawing , I love to have an A1 board and to beable to move through the space as I work on the design.
Hand rendered drawings & artists impression , freehand for me show an extra essence of creativity,
I myself struggle on a computer with tasks such as cad ( I have tried, for some we just speak the same language as a computer )
Hand work for me gives a personal touch. its just you interacting with the drawing & on A1 ( or bigger ) one is able to work with the entire space as opposed to a smaller screen.
I feel often when I see CAD etc that they do look amazing ( when done with great skill ) . yet I do see that they can also make a not so great design look better than it is as they can give a wow factor.
In an ideal world Id love to beable to do both , however I really dont see the time when I could punish myself learning ( the teacher in my class walked a long way around me )
There is a place for each format in the industry & I certainly know where my talent lies which is not in computers.
Kerrie John-The garden design Co said:Whilst I like the 3D view of a CAD plan and the facility to 'walk' around the garden they are without soul, too brightly coloured and perfect. For me there is nothing better than a clean sheet of A1, a pencil and the ability take in all the space available, it's pure freedom. And there is nothing as wonderful than a beautifully produced garden plan, wonky paving lines, shadows created by rendering and perhaps some added watercolours of some of the planting. Knowing that someone has spent time and great care producing something by hand, is rather special.
Don't know if you are like me, but when I am designing I am actually 'walking' around the space in my head. There is the feeling of scale and purpose to the design.
When designing the planting scheme I see the plants in their mature state and whole garden comes alive. It is then up to my skills to convey this vision to the clients, but if you are passionate about what you have created, this is easy!
-
Permalink Reply by 15jr56izhj6c2 on
-
I have over 30 years experience of CAD/CAM/CAE .... my background is mechanical engineering and I learned CAD when it was in it's infancy
There is a saying .... 'If you use yesterday's technology today .... you will be out of business tommorow'
There are several 3D packages on the market .... and they are not very expensive ... they are specifically geared up to landscapers and have thousands of plants on the database ...
Create a design in minutes ... get fancy and use google earth to speed things up ...
you can design your landscape on different layers, and view the plants /shrubs/trees season by season ... you can even add lighting and view the landscape design at night
take your laptop to your client, sit down next to her/him and knock up a 3D plan in minutes with them participating .... huge selling point
This is a huge selling point, but most importantly, you get an automatic bill of materials, can tender with architects etc as they electronically send you the designs ... you do the landscaping side and email them back to them
do yourself a favour and investigate further `.... it's not hard to learn
-
Permalink Reply by 15jr56izhj6c2 on
-
If you do many designs, you will not have to 'think' for long, as you will have developed your own style/preference and you will know which combinations of plants work well together...
find out what style of garden suits your client and within minutes, you can have a basic layout
Tropical/exotic style seems to be the 'flavour of the year' at present and it takes minutes to create a border on Cad, as many of these plants take up large space
Takes a little longer with a cottage style border, but I have my own microsoft access database that I created with most of the common perennials ...
the whole trick is to utilize the space to a max, and supply colour throughout the year, and combine colours that work well together .... My database is a 'rational' database, so I can filter out criteria and sort in any order I wish ... as an example:
I can sort out a selection of plants based on height, colour of flowers, peak flowering time and the months that the plants flower, as well as the aspect (full sun, semi shade etc) and plant spacings
I also have a selection of my favourite evergreen shrubs which are used as the 'core'/backbone of the design, then fill in the rest of the spaces with perennials etc
by using this info, you can utilize a space to it's max and supply colour in that area for most months of the year
you can call up an existing previous design, and copy parts of the design, then paste them on the new design .... and like I said, this takes minutes to do .... you can sort previous designs by cost .... so, you can find out what budget you have to play with, what style suits your client, then call up a design that falls within that budget and style, and tweak it to your client's bespoke specifications
If you can 'think in 3D', and visualise an empty space which is then filled with shrubs,flowers and colours, you will find Cad very easy to work with .... suppose that is what landscaping is all about?
One thing though, I like to THINK about the garden I'm designing, and cannot 'knock up' a design in minutes.
-
Permalink Reply by Tanya Batkin on -
Interesting, which CAD software do you currently use?
dimitri said:I have over 30 years experience of CAD/CAM/CAE .... my background is mechanical engineering and I learned CAD when it was in it's infancy
There is a saying .... 'If you use yesterday's technology today .... you will be out of business tommorow'
There are several 3D packages on the market .... and they are not very expensive ... they are specifically geared up to landscapers and have thousands of plants on the database ...
Create a design in minutes ... get fancy and use google earth to speed things up ...
you can design your landscape on different layers, and view the plants /shrubs/trees season by season ... you can even add lighting and view the landscape design at night
take your laptop to your client, sit down next to her/him and knock up a 3D plan in minutes with them participating .... huge selling point
This is a huge selling point, but most importantly, you get an automatic bill of materials, can tender with architects etc as they electronically send you the designs ... you do the landscaping side and email them back to them
do yourself a favour and investigate further `.... it's not hard to learn
-
Permalink Reply by 15jr56izhj6c2 on
-
I have an old version of Vectorworks Landmark but have added extra's and created my own libraries etc
here is a good online demo of the 2012 version (a bit pricey though):
http://download2.nemetschek.net/www_movies/2009/LM2009_Overview/LM2...
and here is a youtube clip showing similar software and how it is used:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kANDoNEIN_E&feature=related
you don't have to get Vectorworks .... there are much cheaper packages that do similar (some cheaper than $100 USD) ....
Tanya Batkin said:Interesting, which CAD software do you currently use?
dimitri said:I have over 30 years experience of CAD/CAM/CAE .... my background is mechanical engineering and I learned CAD when it was in it's infancy
There is a saying .... 'If you use yesterday's technology today .... you will be out of business tommorow'
There are several 3D packages on the market .... and they are not very expensive ... they are specifically geared up to landscapers and have thousands of plants on the database ...
Create a design in minutes ... get fancy and use google earth to speed things up ...
you can design your landscape on different layers, and view the plants /shrubs/trees season by season ... you can even add lighting and view the landscape design at night
take your laptop to your client, sit down next to her/him and knock up a 3D plan in minutes with them participating .... huge selling point
This is a huge selling point, but most importantly, you get an automatic bill of materials, can tender with architects etc as they electronically send you the designs ... you do the landscaping side and email them back to them
do yourself a favour and investigate further `.... it's not hard to learn
-
Permalink Reply by Leo Munday on -
Sketchup is free to download and very user friendly. I have never had CAD training and I have trained myself on Sketchup. I also do hand drawn and use a mixture of both.
With CAD I like the fact that I dont have to keep making trips to the printers, I can email the concept to the client for feedback.
Initial concept sketches are always done by hand for that first meeting though. Just my 2p worth.
© 2013 Landscape Juice ® Limited - Registered in England 08356644
Badges | Report an Issue | Privacy Policy | Terms of Service
