Open Association of Landscape Industries
Certificates - legal requirements- help and advice please
Hi, the wet weather has found me trawling the internet and scaring myself about legals,H & S etc. I know I am going to sound like a total amateur - but can anyone point me in the right direction for the definitive answers as to what is a legal requirement and what is a "desirable" as far as ceritifcation is concerned. I am new to this after setting up as a sole trader recently, doing domestic gardens. I dont do high tree-work. I am not a cowboy - have a lot of horticulture knowledge and experience and want to provide a professional service to customers.
Customers ask me to spray their block paving to keep the dandelions down, and also to apply granular lawn treatments. I am very H & S conscious and discuss what is used, child/pet safety etc. I only use over the counter stuff from stores (Roundup, Evergreen etc). I use a mask, gloves, overalls.
Do I need a PA1/PA6 certificate for this - and can anyone advise about costs/renewals etc.
Is there anything else I should have as a legal requirement. (I have my public liability).
Apologies for a long post.
Replies to This Discussion
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PRO MemberPermalink Reply by Paul McNulty on -
Agreed, you need to be certified if you use ANY chemicals as part of your business. Find a local trade supplier as well, the over-the-counter products from DIY stores etc. are far more expensive!
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Permalink Reply by Dave Lockney on -
Thanks. I sort of thought it would be a legal. Now the problem is to find somewhere in the north east of england who does this - and then find the money! I wonder if this course can be done as Distance Learning?
Yes - my Roundup I bought it off the internet much cheaper than DIY stores.
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PRO MemberPermalink Reply by Phil Voice on -
Hi Dave
There is still a bit of a grey area about Pa1 & Pa6 certification. Anyone born before 31 December 1964 (that includes myself) is still entitled to apply pesticides professionally without a Pa1 (that's the foundation module everyone has to take regardless of the method of application thereafter) or Pa6 certificate of competence (Pa6a is the further certificate module needed to apply pesticides using a pedestrian knapsack sprayer).
See National Training Proficiency Council NPTC assessment schedules here: http://www.nptc.org.uk/assessment-schedules/
There is a consultation being undertaken to ask for views on withdrawing grandfather rights - see this HSE page
Phasing out of grandfather rights for pesticide users.
If anyone is born after 31 December 1964 and they are applying pesticides professionally (that is they are being paid and it is not on their own property) then they are legally required to posses a Pa1 & Pa6a certificate of competence.
A professional user is not permitted to use products bought from a retail outlet.
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PRO MemberPermalink Reply by Phil Voice on
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PRO MemberPermalink Reply by Phil Voice on -
I noticed the grandfather rights page on the HSE site is rather old. I have contacted HSE today to ask what the latest is regarding grandfather rights is.
They've promised to get back to me early next week.
Phil Voice said:Hi Dave
There is still a bit of a grey area about Pa1 & Pa6 certification. Anyone born before 31 December 1964 (that includes myself) is still entitled to apply pesticides professionally without a Pa1 (that's the foundation module everyone has to take regardless of the method of application thereafter) or Pa6 certificate of competence (Pa6a is the further certificate module needed to apply pesticides using a pedestrian knapsack sprayer).
See National Training Proficiency Council NPTC assessment schedules here: http://www.nptc.org.uk/assessment-schedules/
There is a consultation being undertaken to ask for views on withdrawing grandfather rights - see this HSE page
Phasing out of grandfather rights for pesticide users.
If anyone is born before 31 December 1964 and they are applying pesticides professionally (that is they are being paid and it is not on their own property) then they are legally required to posses a Pa1 & Pa6a certificate of competence.
A professional user is not permitted to use products bought from a retail outlet.
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Permalink Reply by Dave Lockney on
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Thanks Phil. I had read about grandfather rights but got confused - and still am! .(.I was born prior to 1964) On one hand it seems to indicate I dont need certificates to comply, but on the other hand if I am using them professionally I still need them. !?!? A local (ish) college will do both the PA1 and PA6 as one day courses for £405. Quite a bit to pay if I dont legally need them - although I am sure that the courses would be informative. Much appreciate your support and look forward to seeing what the HSE say before I commit to the course (due to run on 9th May!). Dave
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Permalink Reply by Lawnman on
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Kirkley Hall at Ponteland runs the course.
Day 1 theory, day 2 practical, PA1 computer test exam conditions, PA6 practical test with examiner.
Dave Lockney said:Thanks. I sort of thought it would be a legal. Now the problem is to find somewhere in the north east of england who does this - and then find the money! I wonder if this course can be done as Distance Learning?
Yes - my Roundup I bought it off the internet much cheaper than DIY stores.
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Permalink Reply by Dave Lockney on
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Thanks. I will contact Kirkley Hall. I am not averse to some training - it can all only be good eh? But still interested to see whether it is a legal requirement or not.
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Permalink Reply by choughman on -
with regards to grandfathers rights. I was told when i did my spraying cert that this only applied to usage on OWN land. The law was a bit murky regarding rented areas but clearly stated that on other property, for payment etc YOU MUST have the certs.
Course Phil knows more than i do i'm sure and my spray test was done many years ago!
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Permalink Reply by David Strong on -
Newton Rigg College in Penrith mate
Duncan said:That's a better one. I was just going to say Barony College just over the border or I think there's one in Penrith too, can't remember the name.
Lawnman said:Kirkley Hall at Ponteland runs the course.
Day 1 theory, day 2 practical, PA1 computer test exam conditions, PA6 practical test with examiner.
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Permalink Reply by Lawn lover on -
I was also born before 1964, I did spray using Grandfather rights as a reason to save doing PA1 - PA6 till I looked into legislation in more depth.
If you are doing the spraying for monetary gain you should have a PA1 PA6
For your public liability insurance you would need to show you had received training if some one tried to sue you.
Grandfather rights is for the bloke with a small holding, own land even his allotment,, not as a screen to avoid getting the correct certification to operate for gain in this industry.
This site opened my eyes to a lot of misconception within this industry
Phil Voice said:Hi Dave
There is still a bit of a grey area about Pa1 & Pa6 certification. Anyone born before 31 December 1964 (that includes myself) is still entitled to apply pesticides professionally without a Pa1 (that's the foundation module everyone has to take regardless of the method of application thereafter) or Pa6 certificate of competence (Pa6a is the further certificate module needed to apply pesticides using a pedestrian knapsack sprayer).
See National Training Proficiency Council NPTC assessment schedules here: http://www.nptc.org.uk/assessment-schedules/
There is a consultation being undertaken to ask for views on withdrawing grandfather rights - see this HSE page
Phasing out of grandfather rights for pesticide users.
If anyone is born after 31 December 1964 and they are applying pesticides professionally (that is they are being paid and it is not on their own property) then they are legally required to posses a Pa1 & Pa6a certificate of competence.
A professional user is not permitted to use products bought from a retail outlet.
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PRO MemberPermalink Reply by Gary RK on -
Great response & well said, Martin.
I guess we're all giving our age away here........;-)
Lawn lover said:I was also born before 1964, I did spray using Grandfather rights as a reason to save doing PA1 - PA6 till I looked into legislation in more depth.
If you are doing the spraying for monetary gain you should have a PA1 PA6
For your public liability insurance you would need to show you had received training if some one tried to sue you.
Grandfather rights is for the bloke with a small holding, own land even his allotment,, not as a screen to avoid getting the correct certification to operate for gain in this industry.
This site opened my eyes to a lot of misconception within this industry
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